Consciousness: Two Babies Talking in the Womb

two babies talking in the wombThis parable has circulated around the internet over the last couple of years in different forms. According to Wayne Dyer, the original story was told by Henri J. W. Nouwen. However, it appears that all of these “mini-versions” have been adapted from the writings of Pablo Molinero. I’ve included a link to his original in the comments below.

It is a thought-provoking idea. What if you could remember? In a way, isn’t that what consciousness is all about—remembering the truth of who we truly are?

My question to you is, How are you becoming more conscious? The invitation is here. The gifts are endless.

It’s time for you. Because you can.

The Parable

In a mother’s womb were two babies.  The first baby asked the other:  “Do you believe in life after delivery?”

The second baby replied, “Why, of course. There has to be something after delivery.  Maybe we are here to prepare ourselves for what we will be later.”

“Nonsense,” said the first. “There is no life after delivery.  What would that life be?”

“I don’t know, but there will be more light than here.  Maybe we will walk with our legs and eat from our mouths.”

The doubting baby laughed. “This is absurd!  Walking is impossible.  And eat with our mouths?  Ridiculous.  The umbilical cord supplies nutrition.  Life after delivery is to be excluded.  The umbilical cord is too short.”

The second baby held his ground. “I think there is something and maybe it’s different than it is here.”

The first baby replied, “No one has ever come back from there.  Delivery is the end of life, and in the after-delivery it is nothing but darkness and anxiety and it takes us nowhere.”

“Well, I don’t know,” said the twin, “but certainly we will see mother and she will take care of us.”

“Mother?” The first baby guffawed. “You believe in mother?  Where is she now?” 

The second baby calmly and patiently tried to explain. “She is all around us.  It is in her that we live. Without her there would not be this world.”

“Ha. I don’t see her, so it’s only logical that she doesn’t exist.”  

To which the other replied, “Sometimes when you’re in silence you can hear her, you can perceive her.  I believe there is a reality after delivery and we are here to prepare ourselves for that reality when it comes….”

 ~     ~     ~     ~     ~

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71 Responses

  1. Yes. Now we are spirit children of our Heavenly
    Father in embryo preparing to return to him through the atonement of his beloved son, Jesus Christ

      1. Nice story,but I have one doubt “Either the brother believe in mother and the life after birth or not” he will come out from moms womb after 9 month and he realize that there is one mother and a place to live. The sister believe in mother and life after birth she is also come out from moms womb after 9 month. one is believing other is unbelieving but both get the same result. so what is the relevance of this belief. am i right.??
        expecting your reply.thank you.

        1. Roni, I’m not sure what it is that you doubt. Perhaps you could question that of yourself. The relevance of this parable for me happens when I extend this dialogue to my daily life. That I am not alone, that there is is an energy that extends beyond me and that it is in support of me in each moment. I can choose to not acknowledge that. Or I can choose to celebrate the experience that I have of this that I have over and over. The inner guidance that is available to me (and to you) is something that I treasure.

        2. Hi Roni,
          I felt to respond to your thoughtful comment…

          First up, I’d say this story is obviously an analogy. It’s rare that we can take analogies through to a logic conclusion. That’s simply not how they tend to work. Analogies rely on metaphor, and there’s typically no logical conclusion for such things. If I say, “Your beautiful eyes are large and bright like the full moon,” we can’t draw a logical conclusion from that metaphor, because obviously at a logical level of tangible reality your eyes and the moon have very little in common. So, with that in mind, I see little point in attempting to credit or discredit this piece of prose based on whether I do or not like the logical conclusions I might try to draw from it. Such as, the one you make about the boy and girl having the same result whether they believe in “the Mother” or not.

          However, having said that… I feel you’ve raised a valid point, in the sense that there is value in exploring that notion of whether or not belief make a difference, etc. For me, God (however one choses to define That Power that creates us) is not dependant on my (or anyone’s) belief. I may have perception of That Power, and thus need no beliefs around it. Or I might not have perception of it, and may choose to hold beliefs about whether it does (theist) or does not exist (atheist), or might choose to remain completely undecided (agnostic).

          Take the case of the babies. If the boy has direct perception/experience of “the Mother,” (as he claims to) does he then need belief about it? I’d say not. In my observation, belief is only required for that which is not real (whether subjectively or objectively so). Something may be *real* (objectively/universally), and yet not real in my own direct experience (subjectively/personally), so I may use belief to make it *true* for me, despite the fact it’s not part of the reality I directly perceive and experience. On that basis, I would say the measure of *enlightenment* (or consciousness) is how accurately what is true for me matches reality. Is what I hold to be true, also (universally) real? Are my each of my beliefs serving as a bridge to reality, or to falsity/delusion/deception?

          Coming back to the analogy of the babies, and your concern that both have the same outcome whether they “believe” in the existence of “the Mother” or not… Who’s to say they won’t and, if so, why not? Who’s to say something else wouldn’t come to pass? For instance, perhaps the girl (in this case) will be born blind, and never directly see “the Mother,” and have to deal with the consequences of that. Perhaps she’ll be still-born, and have to go through another birth cycle, and another chance to get it right (to not “miss the mark,” i.e. “not sin.” Perhaps she’ll be born normally, and experience “the Mother” directly, and yet as she grows she plays out powerful tendencies to be disobedient and rebellious, because for whatever reason she lacks a deep-seated sense of connection and relatedness with “the Mother,” and she then has to face the consequences of that. If we attempt to take this analogy to some kind of logical conclusion, and number of outcomes are possible.

          But, as I said, I suspect it may be fruitless trying to stretch an analogy too far, toward some kind of conclusion. They are generally intended to invoke certain feelings in the reader, to poetically bring certain perspectives to our attention.

          With heart…


          1. Hi Jonathan,
            Thanks for your reply but poetry is not an excuse to skew facts.

            There are many dangers of this kind of allegory …
            1. There is a conclusion. To use your analogy… “Your eyes are like the moon. I believe that if we burn them under intense heat we will have enough power to propel a rocket to the moon and that is real”
            2. It takes advantage of our desperate need to validate our tenets, fears, rumours, etc regardless of the truth. This is a very worrying trend with far reaching consequences. I am sure we are all now very aware of the impact of half truths.
            3. Over-simplication. Yes like you said .. it is just a story… but…. like you said as well it leaves a lot of is like a movie with so many glaring plot holes, terrible directing and really bad acting *rendering it incapable of invoking feeling of awe*. It is too far removed from reality. a) mother could die even before birth b) both babies could die etc….
            3. The worst part is … What if the baby is right. And there is a mother? Will the mother kill the baby that doubted for being the Thomas in the plot? How cruel is it to imagine any manner or form of consequences from an “all knowing” mother. This is the true malignance of the story, it’s own “logical” conclusion. How can loving Christians propagate such ideals?

        3. The difference is one will go to live with mother happy for believing in the unknown and having faith. The other “the mother” will cast him to hell where he will live forever……in flames for not believing in “mother”! Who needs love when we have mothers. Who needs enemies with a mother like that! But hey its that babies own fault for not believing in what “they” told him to believe in!

          1. Or quiet possibly, just as each of us learns at different levels and in different ways as individuals (no matter our “disability”), both babies are delivered and lovingly cared for equally for their entire existence (whatever and however long that may be), learning through “making choices” as they are created to live and learn. Through all of this gaining whatever level of conciseness they are created to gain. Then continuing on their journey of being lovingly purified by whatever means necessary to enter the next birth where they will continue to grow in love. The perception that something we are experiencing is evil rather than loving is only as we view it through the eyes of our reality (how we perceive our lives by comparing the past and present, and what we perceive to be the future of ourselves and others). Thus I view the goal “lift your perception to love” (“follow after love”). Shalom to you all!

          2. The way I see it, the parable, as it is written here, just says that people who believe in life after death, no matter what their religion, may be right. It doesn’t say anything about what happens after the babies are birn, although I understand that the original parable, by Pablo Molinero, did.

        4. Good question.
          I would say for the believer it just makes the 9 month as in this parable more comforting, carefree, enriched, happy and a good foundation to continue the being the same even after the 9 months. Also the believer will have a easier journey, transistion.

        5. This parable isn’t complete here. Its complete version is given in Pablo J Molinero’s book, “The Boy And Girl 2”. In that book, you will come to know that the baby(boy) who doubted the existence of Mother, died at the time of delivery. While the baby girl was born alive and got into a wide world where she was able to see her Mother caring herself. So this is how an unbeliever got the reward of what he used to expect.

          1. That is on way to look at it, and really a matter of one’s world view and experience of life, Hamraj. By the way, I have referenced Molinero’s version in the comments to this post.

        6. Both come out, yes…but to what? Perhaps one a life of heavenly love and joy, and the other a life of hell?

          1. Each will have their own journey. Perhaps one will remember who they really are. And the other will take the journey back to remembrance. That’s the journey that most of us are on.

        7. Your point might be beyond what this metaphor is intended. Metaphors have limited meanings. It is only good for what the author wants to emphasize. Yours may not have been thought of the author itself.

  2. Can’t get this out of my head nor do I want to.completely agree with previous two comments.wish everyone reading this could see the true meaning of it which is our Heavenly Father is there for us all if only you believe in him.

      1. Vey beautiful story !
        Uplifting and inspirational and very helpful when you have lost a loved one like I did.
        My loved one is living in another world which is bigger and better than life here !

  3. Why is do we believe we only have one creator – our heavenly father?
    In order for the two babies to grow in the womb it took a father and a mother to make them? Mmmmmmmmm

    1. Through our limited perspective it takes a mother and a father to make children, but through the one who created them male and female there is not a complete experience until the two become one. Thus we learn about the creators character by the reality that as male and female attributes combined they become the one creation that is in the image of their creator. No this does not mean that someone who never marries cannot grow, please see my above comment. Shalom to all!

  4. This just proves that we have a Heavenly Mother! Without mother we cant exist God the father made things exist through this physical life to testify the Spitural life God is know to be our Father but in order to be called Father you have to have kids and in order to have kids you have to have a mother because only a mother can have kids! Our Heavenly mother is testified throughout the whole bible from Genesis to Revelation

    1. Racheal…you are Mormon…this is your belief…in a Heavenly Mother who has “spiritual babies” and the babies are “assigned” to an earthly family. If any of you want to experience some “far out” nonsense, study Mormonism as I did for five years! (I had to because we unknowingly moved into a Mormon community and we had five small children. We had to know what we were facing…wow, Joseph Smith, the “founder” of Mormonism, REALLY had some issues!!) I still find it amazing that very intelligent people can believe in Mormonism.

  5. Good one. But I have a very simple question. Just out of curiosity. After the twins were delivered, did the mother cook the baby who did not believe in life after delivery? Did she put it in an oven and baked it? Did the other twin had a wonderful life? Won’t the mother love them both regardless?

  6. Completely agree with previous two comments.wish everyone reading this could see the true meaning of it which is our Heavenly Father is there for us all if only you believe in him.

  7. This story has apparently been modified from the original wording in “Your Sacred Self: Making the Decision to Be Free” by Wayne W. Dyer, HarperCollins Publishers, 2009. It appears at the very beginning of the book.

    I thought you’d like to know for proper notation purposes.

    1. Thank you, Rob. In checking out Wayne’s book, I see that the original story comes from the great Henri J. M. Nouwen. I appreciate you taking the time to let me know! Laurie

      1. That’s good to know. I’ll check into that. I’m interested in seeing if Dyer modified it from Nouwen’s original version, because I don’t care for Dyer’s version very much.

        Thanks, Rob

      2. The original is from Henri Nouwen’s “Our Greatest Gift, A Meditation on Dying and Caring” (Harper One, 2009) pages 18-19. As an author, I always want to give the creative source credit with a proper notation. I had recently seen this quote for the first time on FB and wanted to repost it. That led me to your nice blog. Thanks for helping me track it down. -Rob

        1. I’m with you Rob! I’m glad it led you here and hope there is more that will inspire. Wander around! Laurie

    1. The translation of the Hungarian author’s name “Útmutató a Léleknek” is “A Guide to the Spirit” – thus it is not really a ‘name’ as much as an intent.
      Hungarian: Útmutató a Léleknek” = English Translation: “A Guide to the Spirit”
      Relative to Pablo’s claim this was plagiarism and the poem is his – no. Different approaches, different thoughts, different rhythm to the writings, different intent, different outcome, different essence.
      “Útmutató a Léleknek” is “A Guide to the Spirit” – is thought provoking, enlightening, creative, elevating, non-exclusive, non-categorical and piercing. It could be any two people contemplating their situation.

      Pablo’s work is dark. It separates the babies by gender (categorizes by gender/excludes) rather than different thinking/believing processes (pessimist vs optimist, non-believer vs believer, etc).
      It ends on a harsh note – the boy baby disappears – his life is taken via a cord strangulation.
      Pablo also negatively claims this is plagiarism.
      He rules out the ability of multiple people using similar platforms to express visions or ideas.
      How many times have we thought we were original in our thoughts – only to discover a dear friend has similar thoughts or stumbling across writings from another that sound like us (although we have not publicized our writings)?
      The lightness of the Parable of the Two Babies that was written by “A Guide to Spirit” is quite the contrast to the dark work of Boy and Girl.
      I could go on – as there are other areas/levels.
      However, plagiarized – I think not.
      Pablo’s unique work – no.

  8. Let’s say there was third baby …

    Third baby: We should sing songs to Mother, about how great Mother is and how much Mother loves us unconditionally.

    Second baby: Yes, that sounds like a great idea!

    Third baby: And also sing about Brother!

    Second baby: Wait, who’s Brother?

    Third: Brother is Mother’s first son. But he’s also Mother.

    Second: Wait, huh?

    Third: Don’t worry, our baby minds are too undeveloped to understand, but trust me, Brother is as real as Mother, and they’re two separate people, but also the same person.

    Second: How do you know this?

    Third: Because of the Book!

    Second: There’s a Book? Really?

    Third: Yes, there’s a Book! Mother has very specific instructions for us in this Book. It was written by other babies, but inspired by Mother herself.

    Second: How do you know it was inspired by Mother?

    Third: Because another baby wrote that right here in the Book! Also, Mother told me this personally.

    Second: That’s strange, I wonder why Mother hasn’t told me that yet. But OK … Tell me more about Brother.

    Third: The most important thing to know about Brother is that Brother loves you so much that he died for you.

    Second: Wait, he’s dead? How tragic! I would have liked to meet him.

    Third: Yes! He died for you! But you can still meet him … he’s your master and he’s waiting for you after delivery. That’s the good news!

    Second: Wait, if he’s dead, how can he be waiting for me?

    Third: Look, Brother died so that we can live. You must believe that in order to be saved.

    Second: Saved from what?

    Third: Eternal fire where there is weeping and gnashing of teeth.

    Second: That sounds intense. OK, so Mother loves us so much that she made Brother die for us, because that’s the only way we can live. But Brother’s not actually dead anymore. And if I don’t believe in Brother and call him master, then Mother will send me to the furnace after delivery? And that’s how Mother expresses her unconditional love to us? And that’s good news? And this is all in the Book you found that was written by other babies?

    Third: Yes! You finally got it! Hallelujah!!

  9. Laurie, I am also amazed at how the story is sparking responses especially from Christians, who believe in life after death.
    As Christians it is important to make sure we know what we are talking about, lest Satan tempts us to pick the easy road of just spreading things that may have messages that may not agree with Jesus or our core values.
    The first time, I got this story I was truly touched and I forwarded it to all my friends.
    It was the worst mistake I had ever done and that I learnt some very important lessons.
    Two of my friends are blind and one is crippled. They said the story was upsetting to them because it made them feel inadequate and they felt quite sad. I honestly did not expect that response.
    My other friend, who is also a very good born again Christian, got depressed because when she was born she never saw her mother. She was dumped on the wayside and she was raised as an orphan.
    Luckily, they all forgave me but I promised myself and God that I’ll be more careful. I really really felt bad (cried a lot)

    So I was just reading through your comments and something really caught my eye. As pointed out by Roni Vincent, both kids will have the “same” result. As Christians, it important to also take into consideration other people and what they think. I’d like to tell Roni thanks for pointing this out, because I felt the same thing when I read the story the second time. I believe this is by far and large the most important thing about the story. Because we all know about mother’s love right? The mother will not reject, kill, beat, torture or punish the baby who doubted. Would God really punish people for doubting? I am afraid to judge sometimes. Because we know that a mother’s love is unconditional. Maybe there is a mother out there who will kill her child for not believing in her, I sincerely hope no such person is allowed to be a mother. This story really confused me and I really hard to pray hard about it.

    On a more positive note, my family doctor told me that, babies can communicate with their mothers and even fathers! through touch and speech while still in the womb. She said that this was good for both the babies and parents. I was very happy to know this whole thing is unlikely to happen, (if babies can talk in the womb), because I must admit I was a little worried about the doubting baby (hell, suffering etc). I wanted a happy ending for both babies, maybe because I just like babies too much. God bless.

    1. your answer totally struck a cord with me.
      I was shocked to see how negatively people reacted to a story that made me feel so one with the universe.
      I am not a christian but I believe that we are so much more. And what ever mother is, I am sure she is not evil. And if you doubt then that just all right. One day you will see the light maybe not in this life but you will… of that I am sure. Love to you all, be good to one another. Thats the most important.

  10. This analogy really stuck with me long after reading it. It has helped me talk to friends about death, God, and life after death. I drew comfort from the fact that their are some people who will deny “Mother” and any life outside of the womb. Christians who die believe not only in “Mother” (God) but in life after the womb. Our bodies do become different after birth: we grow, we crawl, we walk, and we go from dependence to independence. After death, we go through some type of transformation, we are “changed.” I am excited about the transformation and yet it is mysterious and confusing as it was when Nicodemus discussed being “born again.” He even asked, “How can I crawl back into my mother’s womb?”
    Thank you, again, for sharing and giving me something to ponder.

    1. I’m so glad that this was helpful to you Cynthia! My experience is that there are levels and levels of understanding that we get to experience as we open ever more deeply to the wisdom within.

  11. This is, undoubtedly, a great imagination, ignited millions of brains. No matter, what the reality is?

  12. The following might be best avoided by women who have had an abortion, especially recently, and are experiencing guilt, and/or sensitive about it. For others, including women strong enough to consider it, it’s something to think about.

    A possible ending just given to me, that becomes a reality for millions of unborn children unfortunately, and casts doubt on the glorification of the Mother, because of the assault on the Divine Feminine by feminism:

    “”And then the cold steel instruments of abortion appeared, violating the sanctity and security of the womb, and ripped the two twins to pieces, removing them from their blissful sanctuary as has been done to millions of babies before them, while the words, “Sorry kids, Mother doesn’t want you, after all” echoed around them, and the pieces of their torn and mangled bodies were relegated to a medical waste bin… and God only knows what became of their consciousness.” -FMZ

    How would that affect the consciousness of the babies in this story (which are gratefully given the dignity of being called “babies”, and not “products of conception” etc), and what kind of “birth” into the next life would that be for them??

  13. What a laughable analogy! Analogies are analogies because they’re not the same thing BUT, they have to share the same logical bases, otherwise they’re neither useful nor generalisable to the target topic! Before and after, in this case, is a continuation of life, which is not comparable to life after death (i.e., absence of life as we know it.) So, sorry to piss on your hopes but all these stupid analogies do is to, yet again, help those who are incapable of digesting the material truth (or simply feel empty because of it) continue living their fake lives. Good luck with that!

    1. Beautifully and eloquently explaining what it is you believe is not the same thing as explaining why or how your beliefs are true. Just because you found a way to clearly and beautifully explain what you believe, does not automatically prove its truth. When things are actually true, they don’t need to be dressed up with flowers and glitter. You never see science books with golden edges with expensive hand sewn leather covers. This baby in the womb analogy may strike a chord with some people but striking a chord and making you feel warm in your heart does not make something true. Children believing in Santa Claus makes children happy and causes them to act well but that doesn’t make Santa clause real. Also let me point out that if the mother wants to actually have the baby, she doesn’t stab and punch the fetus in the womb, yet that’s exactly what happens to actual babies and grown people every day. What kind of mother is that? So this baby in the womb analogy doesn’t actually hold up very well in a debate.

  14. In all due respect to all those who like this story (which we all do!), but the first time this story appeared in print was in the 1947 in Jerusalem by Orthodox Rabbi Yechiel Michel Tucazinsky. In the book the conversation is a bit more longer and poignant, and a parable between the Believer and Unbeliever. Yes we are all brothers and got here through the miracle of Birth. Here are a couple of links including a very inspirational song which took the idea of the book in a most beautiful way.


  15. I absolutely loved the beautiful melody and lyrics and appreciate you sharing. I also loved the parable although I did not analyze it so deeply as many of my fellow internet friends did. Leaving it open provides the unique opportunity for it to speak to us as we desire or perhaps need.
    Thank you.

    1. Yes, Jude! I always feel the importance of tapping into one’s own relationship with a parable like this. It will speak to us where we most need it. Thanks for your comment. Laurie

  16. This is typical new age deception. Hebrews 9 versus 27-28 ” it is appointed for man to die once and then judgement”. These new age people are leading millions into an abyss. All of us dies and then in the resurrection we are judged by the perfect Judge Jesus Christ of Nazareth. There is no death and then our spirit goes into the spirit of the universe or reincarnation or a halfway house. We either obtaine everlasting life through the work of the Man Jesus Christ or we receive eternal separation from God.

    This story though cute just tells you any god will do . There is only one God made of 3 separate persons. The Father, The Son and Holy Spirit.

  17. I am going try, extending this thread further of how this story struck a chord for me.

    The discussion between the two babies is not about faith, it is about how one baby is sharing a knowledge based on prior experience, while the other baby is limited in knowledge lacking an experience.

    And this analogy is probing on subjective nature of reality, rather than objective nature of the phenomenal world. Who is the Mother? Creation or the invisible causative factors behind the Creation? It is probing on the nature of reality whether it is light or darkness, or both light and darkness.

    Just as words limit in conveying the full extent of an experience, same applies to conveying knowledge based ideas on Truth and Reality. For true experience, as it is for true knowledge – its best we learn when to “let go” of the intellect, and how to engage the intellect.

    Usually, when we let go of intellect, we fall back on belief, and hence that is where the faith appears as a feature. However it seems like an analogy less on a discourse on faith, and more of a discourse on subjective experiences of truth based on knowledge and the conviction in the nature of reality, in the context of consciousness.

    1. Thank you for such an insightful comment (and commentary), Deepa. When we include our own experience, our felt reality, we take a quantum leap in understanding. That is even more than faith. Intellect alone is limited.

  18. I see it as an analogy of life after death.
    As we all are aware, there are believers and there are unbelievers, but the fact is, there is life after the womb (which the unbelieving twin will find out). As we know, the believing twin already believes it. Hence, for those alive on earth presently either believe in life after death or not. God has made it abundantly clear that there is life after death and He has also provided a way for us to experience eternal life of our choosing. Either in heaven with the saints or in hell with the unbelievers.
    Heaven is attainable through our confession of sin and accepting that Jesus paid our sin debt in full.

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